Giving timely and honest feedback to help people be their best selves at work

[HR Impact] Abby Hamilton X CT

CheeTung Leong: [: 00:00:00

She's passionate about empowering employees to bring their best selves to work. And using data driven decision making and performance management to align people's strategy with business goals and vision. Here to tell us more about LiveIntent and her role there is Abby Hamilton. Welcome to the studio.

Abby Hamilton: Thank you so much. Thank you for having me as well.

CheeTung Leong: Tell us a little bit more about LiveIntent, what you do there. And and then we'll dive into some of the specifics of the

show.

Abby Hamilton: I'm the chief people officer at LiveIntent, and in the time in my organization, I've absolutely grown here, been super appreciative of the time and the people that I've gotten to work with here.

ys I walked into the door. I [: 00:01:00

CheeTung Leong: Timely and honest conversations with each other. I'm assuming this isn't a how's, how was your day type of conversation. How would you describe the context of these conversations and why it's important to stress that honesty and timeliness in these conversations?

re you doing, but digging in [: 00:02:00

And the reality is it just doesn't have to be that way. Feedback can also be sharing, you know what? You did a really great job there and you should be proud of yourself. And if you think about it as kind and respectful and something that helps the individual get better.

Yes, we're looking at past activities and what happened, but think of it more as coaching conversations for the future or taking what happened and how to pivot it next time, or maybe get different results or how do we just. Get better and stronger as an organization. It's really about focusing on those areas we all have for growth.

hose individuals up for much [: 00:03:00

As soon as you can afterwards, I'm not saying always do these in a group full of people. You actually shouldn't do that, but instead really talking to people and sharing thoughts and think of it as developing them for the future.

CheeTung Leong: Those are great points. We don't come into this world naturally knowing how to give feedback to each other.

I'm gonna get ready for this [: 00:04:00

Even going back to what you said earlier, like when you're through that promotion cycles and you want to have that continuous feedback throughout the year that has just gone by.

That actually requires everyone to be hypersensitive to feedback moments, both positive and negative. How do you go about even building that muscle ?

Abby Hamilton: I love that you called it a muscle because a muscle is something that takes practice and repetition to build.

So same thing as any other muscle you're trying to build, practice it. And there are ways to enter it softly. You don't have to say, do I want to give you feedback? There's a really great way to enter softly and ask somebody, how do you think you did? I find by doing it that way, it opens up to their perspective, their thoughts, their opinions.

[: 00:05:00

And suddenly, thinking about the question, how do you think you did? Doesn't sound too scary to ask someone versus let me have a feedback conversation with you. That sounds

scary.

CheeTung Leong: That's a really good point. And I think it really flips the dynamic of the conversation rather than saying, Hey, I've got some, something I want to tell you about you that you didn't do well instead.

You're inviting that conversation by saying, how do you think we, you did in that situation? That actually really opens up that opportunity for coaching.

Abby Hamilton: Sure does. And you've added another really great word there and you used we.

[: 00:06:00

CheeTung Leong: In this conversation, we're just talking about how do we shift that frame of reference from you've done something in the past that needs corrections to how do we do better in the future?

The use of we, in this case, it may be one way to put aside that ego because Have you found in your experience that the biggest problem around feedback is actually each of us carries around an ego, big or small, whatever it is, but that ego is that sense of self that blocks out anything that threatens us .

ments, and then move forward [: 00:07:00

Abby Hamilton: Great call out. It hurts your ego that you're not perfect. It hurts my ego that I'm not perfect, but I'm human as are you.

And there's room for that. And I think it takes time to realize that to be the best, you actually do need to examine yourself and your performance and look for the areas where you can get tighter. Athletes will do that. They'll record themselves. They'll watch videos. They'll look at, maybe I should just move my knee or ankle to the left here.

Let me do this. I've watched myself present. That is painful, and if you listen to your own voice, of course you have, you run a podcast, it feels painful to do. However, those are the ways you get better, because you can notice those areas yourself too. Same as having these conversations. So I find if I share areas of development myself, I admit fault where needed.

eople. It helps a lot. And I [: 00:08:00

And the reality was I didn't have it all together in that moment. And what happened wasn't that. They were mean or not understanding, but instead they rallied behind me and they said, let me help you. We've got this. And for me, that was one of those pivotal moments where I recognize that me admitting my areas of development, me admitting where I was struggling or I didn't have the answers actually gave them some fodder to say, I can do that for you.

d because I was modeling the [: 00:09:00

CheeTung Leong: That's so powerful and also very counterintuitive because you would expect that in the traditional model of feedback, here I am to criticize you.

I want to protect my ego. I need to appear as this perfect human being and therefore I can cast judgment out on you. And what you're doing with being vulnerable, being authentic with the team is modeling behavior that you want the team to emulate as well. And instead of being that chink in your armor as the previous model of feedback would see it as, this actually strengthens the receptivity of the message.

his on a one to one level, I [: 00:10:00

We all need development. How do you go about empowering your leaders and other leaders to be able to adopt this model of feedback?

Abby Hamilton: I am a big believer in role playing and talking through the scenarios. And so an easy way to start on that is a lot of that is based in fear. I found fear of judgment, fear of things going wrong. And so let's talk about that.

ur minds made them out to be.[: 00:11:00

But if they are, Bad and that thing does happen. We've already started to crisis plan for it. Our minds are prepared for it And then that allows them to think about that. Okay, what's the worst thing that's gonna happen? It's not that bad Let me enter this and then also I do the same thing with them And see where the starting point that they're coming from in saying something along the lines of, what do you think we should do?

So then I know what their tendency is going to be or what their instincts are or the starting point I'm at versus telling them what they should do. I find just telling people what to do all the time. It doesn't actually work, but seeing where they are, what their instincts are, help coach them to the right solution by asking open ended questions allows them to come to the right solution.

do that over and over again. [: 00:12:00

And if so, find that it's a zone in which we're not judging, we're working together to create the right solution. And then they can go to their people and do the same thing.

CheeTung Leong: If I'm hearing you correctly it's very, this particular role play is very just in time. So if I'm someone in the line that comes to you and says, Hey, Abby, I've got this issue with my team.

They expected me to give them a promotion this year, but we just didn't have the slots for it. And I need to break this news to them and give them that feedback that I had neglected to over the year. Essentially, I would then roleplay that with you if I'm understanding you correctly.

e that open to, to come with [: 00:13:00

Abby Hamilton: Sure. The first time, but if you think of it more of conveying the message and the right steps to take versus convincing them, this is the action to take right now that helps amplify it and make it scalable, right? So give the information on. Why this is helpful and then support them to choose the next right action, right?

So I've read and I've seen this whole convey versus convince theory, and I really like that. And I think that resonates well in the scalability of this giving feedback. So convey the information. Give them the information and then they choose the right actions from that each time. So yes, maybe it takes one or two conversations up front, but then they're able to convey that they're able to move forward and they're able to do it moving forward on their own.

e our. Companies called live [: 00:14:00

Some things and scenarios. And so with that, I think that's really powerful because again, it's not just people or HR saying what to do. It is other leaders coaching each other. And often our role is that in that is we ask a question or we put up a topic and then we try and take a backseat and facilitate more than answer.

e natural mentorship, mentee [: 00:15:00

So it's just not me or an HR business partner stepping in all the time to help this, but people are naturally building relationships and helping each other. And we shake up those groups every couple of months to create even more relationships and get to know other leaders across the business. So I love the topic of amplifying and how do you make it scalable?

The reality is I don't have to be there for all of those things if you have people helping each other. And that's the goal here.

CheeTung Leong: That sounds really smart because you put in place a community that leaders themselves would, you built it for them essentially, and within that context of mentoring each other around how did they become actual coaches, right?

And then to their teams. They model that behavior at the leadership level, which. Can then more easily translate into the individual contributor level. So it sounds like a really smart thing to do. How long did it take you guys to set that program up?

Abby Hamilton: It's [: 00:16:00

And so it doesn't even need to be a heavy deck. It shouldn't be a heavy deck. Actually, it's just a couple of questions to open the conversation and then facilitate or drive it. You do need a topic. You do need some questions to ask, to get people talking. You might need, even need to encourage some participation up front, but once people see that you've created a safe space to talk through these things, it takes on a life of its own, which has been really great to watch as the program has evolved because we don't.

e all really busy and you're [: 00:17:00

CheeTung Leong: Another benefit of this is that it gives it becomes proactive rather than waiting for a leader to come to you with a problem. Now they're bringing it ahead of time to this group and they can solve it that way. So that it sounds like it can be an engine for culture change as well when done over time.

Do you find that leaders are getting better at giving feedback through this program, like with their teams ?

Abby Hamilton: Yeah, some of it is that there are a lot of complaints in the review process that things are shock or surprise, right? So there are those, and then also looking at the reviews themselves. They're well written, they're more thought out, you hear conversations are being had. There's not a ton of Oh, my gosh, I look at the results and conversations with individuals have gone up 25%.

hare with you. But what I do [: 00:18:00

And so the occurrence of those has gone down. Listen, it's not perfect. I'm not going to pretend that there is absolutely zero blame game in all of this. We're still humans, and there's still areas of growth and development, but has it helped? It certainly has, and I think when you look at retention, you see some of that.

When you look at promotion numbers, there's some positivity and movement. There as well. So some of these things is showing up, doing your best, amplifying voices, empowering leaders to do the right thing and knowing that's making an impact.

CheeTung Leong: We've covered quite a lot of ground today and we're almost at time.

So [: 00:19:00

Abby Hamilton: Yeah I love that. And I think it's entering the conversations, knowing that as humans, we see partial pieces of information, partial truths, and then we make up the rest in our mind of that story and what that looks like.

So you can start by flipping the switch, asking questions along the lines of how do you think you did to open that conversation, see your starting point and understand what that person is already thinking, because it may already match what you think. Second, you can model this behavior yourself.

what you expect them to do, [: 00:20:00

There is a way to do this and build the community around your leaders with other leaders so that they rely on each other. So people don't want to always call HR or the people team. I get it. Let them rely on each other. And so if you create that community and that safe place to do that, you will find that they will call each other to say, Hey, I'm faced with this.

This is what's happening. What do I do?

CheeTung Leong: Perfect. Flipping the switch, modeling that behavior and building that community with role play. That's awesome and very actionable. Thank you so much, Abby, for being on the show. If people want to find you, what's the best way for them to reach out to you?

d be the best place there at [: 00:21:00

CheeTung Leong: Thank you so much for hanging with us today. And for those of you who are listening, I hope you enjoyed the show. Make sure to drop us a review and tune in the next time on the HR impact show.